Hey jojjelito, I started a thread at Mutable since I couldn’t find your post, though I did see it. Would love to see this get to over a 100 pcbs for another price break.
Also, think we should consider a bulk order from Mouser or otherwise US side for encoders to get a big price break. Regular breaks are around 10,25,50,100 pieces and the price can drop significantly in those numbers.
Also started a thread at monome.org to advertise this.
Cool beans!
My thread over at Mutable was titled MIDI Controller Building Blocks or something cryptical like that. I didn’t feel like spamming the MI forum with blatant MIDIbox advertising, nor do I want to spam MIDIbox with too much talk of Shruthis, Ambika and Anushri or MIDIpal :whistle: It would save us all heaps of dough if it came to be a 100-board order, plus an encoder bulk would be nice. 4 boards, that’s lots of switched encoders just for me… Add some more people and we’ll quickly enter price nirvana! :frantics:
I think that Jérôme has enough work with one bulk, hopefully someone in continental Europe (us Swedes would run into expensive postage to most anybody else) will step up. Or someone stateside who’d be willing to send a few boxes of 10USD worth of electronics…
Someone stateside would have to ship a giant box to one person, or we would all be hit by import fees, I don’t know anything about the Swedish system, but in Denmark we’re hit for 150DKK if our total order (incl shipping) is more than 80DKK & from outside of Europe (150DKK ~26USD ? )
Which is why I’m in favor of a “local”/european bulk order for encoders, but I know I don’t have enough credit on this forum to be the one to start it (or enough credit in real life -.-), +shipping from Denmark is just as bad as shipping from Sweden
Not sure if I’m ready to set a bulk order state-side as I am sooo new to this, but might consider it. I think combining an LED/Encoder order would be even smarter given the number of LEDs that will be required for this. Perhaps just ordering a BO for the kit components and splitting them would be the best way to bring the price down for chips/leds/encoders. Thoughts? Will start a discussion on that if necessary.
I think the most critical components which would need a bulk order are encoders and DIL resistor networks. Everyone can find easily cheap LEDs or chips on Ebay e.g.
Hmm, I was thinking of collecting the encoder needs in some bulk or two, depending on people’s location. If it was up to me, I’d get all the encoderama for the EU/Switzerland/Norway/Russia etc in a big box if I was travelling stateside and it would accompany me home. It’s my way of effing the customs idiocracy. Splitting and shipping would ensue. Or, those encoders were a manufacturer warranty repair. All of this is purely hypothetical of course.
In Sweden the customs people usually don’t care if the order is for some small sum of say 500SEK (60€). Unless you’re extremely unlucky, they had the Monday blues or something. Then the bastards at the postal service want 100SEK for their trouble of collecting customs payment, plus the VAT and customs on the order amount… You feel immense pain if your 4 Lolcat T-shirts costing 60USD-ish somhow got intercepted. Add 100SEK plus another 150-170-ish SEK customs and it all gets way more expensive
Anywho, I guess we could find some interesting solution. Like ordering a boatload of encoders straight from the manufacturer in China using Alibaba if there’s a good amount of interest.
Hi Jojjelito i have the same with the switzerland post. Under 5 CHF there are no taxe. After the post add 12 or 16.5 CHF with 3% of the total price. 12 CHF is for near country…
The solution for no have the tax that i found is that the seller say that the parcel is free commercial sample and the cost is 0 or under 30 CHF .
As many people want some components and as resistor networks (SIL and DIL) are not easy to find at good price for few quantity, I add a bulk order only for SIL and DIL resistor networks to this bulk order.
Others components (except encoders) are easily “sourcable” on Internet.
I have modified the Wikipage with 2 new columns.
Importants informations:
>I will make the Mouser order the same moment I will order the PCBs.
>This bulk order will take place only if the ordered amount is a least 65€ (no shipping charges at Mouser).
>Only member which order a PCB can participate (…sorry!).
>The weight (…and the price) of the shipping of the parcel to each member shouldn’t be different (except maybe for 4 boards where the weight was very slightly less than the limit of 0.5kg).
>The price of the 652-4116R-1LF-220 and the 264-10K-RC will be the one Mouser propose regarding the quantity ordered for each item.
I let someone else doing a bulk order for encoders (…severals models, prices and weight to manage).
How about a BO for a ‘universal’ panel? Probably most people would use a panel directly over this PCB any way. Some mounting holes for the PCB, some for mounting to an enclosure, square hole for LCD, some holes for navigation pots/switches … perfect. You could use 2,3,4 of these and stack them up for bigger controllers. And why not standardize on width of 19" racks, so making an enclosure would be easier (did not research this yet). Single panels with all these holes/squares for the LED’s would be expensive. Buying 100+(?) would make that price a whole lot less …
I understood Jerome will be sharing info on panel later … let’s do wait for that
I’m feeling uncertain about organising, I don’t think my credibility and trust on this forum is on par (,yet?!). And then there’s design experience, but hey, one has to start somewhere. I do have time and financial buffers at the moment …
Ideas/interest/tips/support?
Size/colour/material/suppliers?
Will make separate thread when there’s any interest and to not pollute this one …
A panel depends on use-case - some might want a display to go with the encoders, some may not. Modular panels are not as appealing as single-piece ones because they look less professional. Putting a set of encoders into a rack is probably not what most people will find useful, at least not in terms of ergonomics - you’d rather operate encoders on the flat surface of a desktop-case instead. Also, I don’t think a universally good panel exists.
Instead, Ponoko is a very good, cheap and reliable source for individualized panels, and with the panel files available even my grandma can order such a panel (for one, two, three or more encoder PCBs) from there.
In general, for DIY it is a very good idea to take one step at a time, especially for people new to MIDIbox. I am sure most people ordering the PCBs now do not even know what to do with them yet, and I do not even exclude myself from that…
This board is tended to be use in term of modularity either in multiboards project or where this board would be as part of more complex project.
Modularity means unpredictability.
With the rise of personal factory as Ponoko which provide cheap and relatively easy way to create things, the concept of universality seems to disappear.
This idea would have sens in my eyes only in a all-include-project with components/enclosure/application ad-hoc.
Yes if you take “with insurance” it’s means you will be compensated of the amount of the insurance in case of lost and your shipment is tracked (until your door in this country: Germany, Belgium, Danemark, Finland, UK, Hong-Kong, Ireland, Japan, Luxembourg, The Netherlands, Slovakia, Sweden, Swiss and until the French frontier for the others country). In any case I receive a proof of delivery.
So no insurance …no tracking.
Or the cheapest shipment without insurance anyway is traceable?
I won’t go into any fundamental philosophical design discussion, but I do think this remark is a bit normative. In my perception of reality modularity means freedom, elegance, ‘fitness’ and openness to otherwise unseen possibilities. Anywho, I was trying to solve my idea of costs of a metal(!) panel with all these LED holes. Several use cases probably won’t ask for such an universal solution. I was being a bit narrow-minded here?!
If I understand correctly using plastic panels won’t be a big hit in the money pocket … which is a good thing! #8-)
I would like to make a point 1 week after the beginning of the bulk order:
>We have 81 PCBs already ordered so we should probably reach the 100s soon and the price will be break again.
>The amount of the Mouser order is 57,56€ that is to say 7,44€ below the free shipping cost.
I would like to point out that (mostly) DIL resistor networks are difficult to find at good price for few quantities (at least on this side of the Atlantic).
If someone plan to use this type of component, don’t have them and don’t already know where finding them, should ask the question to participate at this bulk order.
I’ll make a new point in some days when we’ll reach the two thresholds.
I would like to share informations I found about the frontpanel I plan to use for my own project. With the number of LEDs of the board(s) maybe it will be useful for someone.
It’s acrylic panel manufactured by Formulor. It’s a German cousin of the famous Ponoko.
I will use their medium grey (transparent) which is in fact the Evonik acrylic GS Grey 7C83 GT already used in Shruthi cases under the name of “Neuropa grey”.
You can find pictures (mutable-instruments/fcd72 copyrighted) here and here.
I have asked Formulor the question about tranparency in case of using red LEDs bargraphs and they are confident that we will see each LEDs distinctly because the transparency is 21%.
You can check this pictures in case of use of green LEDs:
