Building the Midibox SID v2

MIDIbox SID
1

Hello all, I’m new here. As I have around 22 unused SIDs and I have some experience with electronics projects I wanted to build a Midibox SID. I hope anyone here is willing to help me with it.

 

I want to make a stereo sid version with two 6581 sids and full control surface.

 

What I have ordered so far:

 

MBHP_CORE:

  • PIC18F4685-I/P (still have to figure out how to program it)
  • All resistors, trimmpots, capacitors and diodes and bridge rectifier from my own components bin
  • BC337 (wasn’t sure what to buy, so ordered “BC337/16 TO92”, “BC337/25 TO92” and “BC337-40 TO 92”)
  • 6n139 optocoupler
  • sockets

 

2x MBHP_SID:

  • 4x M74HC595B1R
  • 1x IC78L12 (hmm, still need to order another one for the other sid board)
  • 2x “BC547B TO92” and 2x “BC547C TO92” (again wasn’t sure which type to order)
  • sockets and header
  • I don’t know what to do with Styroflex capacitors, they seem obsolete can’t I just replace it with a regular 470 pF ceramic one? I  have those..

 

Bankstick:

  • 24LC256 DIP package

 

DINX2:

  • 4x 74HC165
  • I think I’m short on 10k resistors, so I might have to still order those

 

Control surface:

  • HD44780 compatible LCD Display 20x2 (I ordered this one)
  • 15 rotary encoders from Voti (SW-ROT-01, this seems to be the same as M-SW-ROT mentioned in the walkthrough, but they don’t have those anymore)
  • 110 red leds 5mm
  • Still have to order some buttons
  • For the front panel I have access to a laser cutter

 

As I 'm building a Stereo SID and not a Multi SID solution I guess I don’t need the DOUTX1 module? What about the DINX4 and DOUTX4 modules? I’m not adding additional Core and SID modules.. Also I tried etching my own PCBs, but that ended with a sodium persulfate mess and boards with short circuits, I may have to try that again with Iron Chloride. I find it quite hard to figure out what I need to buy with all these midibox versions and revisions and pcb revisions and configurations options and many dead hyperlinks in the instructions/walkthrough/manual. For example the link to forum article about firmware under the title “Resources” on the bottom of this page http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_manual_hw.html

2

Hi,

 

and welcome to the forum!

 

Just a partial comment: the number of DIN/DOUT modules you need doesn’t depend (except for the four buttons with which you select one of the 2-4 cores) on the number of CORE/SID modules in your build, but on the kind on control surface you want to build. For full control surface you will need three DINX4 (for all the encoders and buttons) and two DOUTX4 modules (for all the LEDs). See scroll down to section “Hardware costs” and under the headline “Complete Control Surface” here: http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_manual_hw.html

 

For connecting the buttons and encoders, see: http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_cs/mbsid_v2_din_default.pdf

..and for connecting the LEDs, see: http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_cs/mbsid_v2_dout_default.pdf

 

Regarding banksticks, in practice you would need at least two: one for Ensembles (=overall settings that you want to save) and another for saving your patches. For the longer run I would choose 24LC512 over 24LC256 to double the amount of patches you can save per bankstick, but that’s just a personal choice :slight_smile:

 

You don’t need styroflex caps for the SID; for the 6581 you can use 470pf ceramic ones. (See http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_manual_hw.html, section “SID chip selection”).

3

Ah thanks, but looking at the schematic, I need two DINX4 boards and one DINX2. Where does the third DINX4 board go? The Styroflex caps were mentioned here: http://www.ucapps.de/mbhp/mbhp_sid_orderlist.txt

 

Also do I need to buy a midi keyboard or midi cable for my pc to get any music out of the Midibox SID? I was hoping I would be able to program the notes and tracks in the midibox using the control surface.

4

You’re going to need two midi cables, one for in and one for out so that you can upload the SID v2 program to the PIC via MIOS Studio.

I have not seen a sequencer for the lead engine in the software yet only the bass and drum engines. Then again I just finished my synth a month ago and haven’t had much time to play with it so I could be missing it. I would recommend a midi keyboard, but if not use a program that puts out midi data so that you can throw sequences at the synth.

If you’re looking for a free program to use get Reaper. It has a trial period, but you can still use it past the trial period. IT is a very power DAW considering how cheap it is for a license.

Also what is your plan for your power supply and case?

5

Well, power supply could be an old ATX psu or the Commodore 64 power brick. For the case I was planning to use an old mixing panel with a replaced surface. For the surface I wanted to use triplex, cut and engraved with a laser cutter.

 

Edit: I just noticed I’m able to program my PIC18F… with my GQ-4X (e)eprom programmer, that would solve the need for a MIDI cable, right?

6

No, because the usual way to program the PIC is via the bootloader. You burn the bootloader on the PIC one time, and thereafter you transfer the OS (MIOS) and the program (MB-SID) via MIDI, using a tool called MIOS Studio.

7

Ah thanks, but looking at the schematic, I need two DINX4 boards and one DINX2. Where does the third DINX4 board go? The Styroflex caps were mentioned here: http://www.ucapps.de/mbhp/mbhp_sid_orderlist.txt

 

You’re right, you need only two DINX4 and one DINX2 – with three DINX4 you’d just leave one half of the third board empty. But for most people doing a modular build, three DINX4 is the way to do it, as DINX4s (but not DINX2) are available at SmashTV or Mike’s shop.

8

First I ordered the LCD at EZTronics, but it never arrived (they insist on having it shipped by regular mail, but I never got it)

Anyway.. that caused some delays but I ordered another one from a known webshop and the remaining parts from Reichelt. Today I received my Reichelt order and I have all the stuff I need to build my Midibox SID (minus 1 pushbutton (should have ordered 41, not 40 :expressionless: ). Also I don’t have PCBs, so I will be using veroboard for the complete build. The buttons I got from Reichelt “Taster 3301D” need to be modified with pliers before they fit the board and they’re much (1.5x) higher than the leds, so I may have to order new ones.

I wanted to start with the leds, so I put them in a block of 8x8 in a veroboard, with all the long and short leads in the same way,

But then I looked at the schematic http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid_cs/mbsid_v2_dout_default.pdf but it doesn’t tell me what’s the best way to place the leds and how to connect everything ( the last thing I would want is mixing up the anodes and cathodes in total or partial ), I don’t like desoldering 64 leds :shifty: Does anyone know how to do this? The schematic mentions the use of bridges instead of resistors (does that mean ‘just wires’?, or should some kind of resistor network be used?)

Is there any other way to upload the Midibox SID operating system to the PIC without the use of the midi port? I don’t have one on my modern PC (i7) and my early Pentium 1 with ISA sound card has a midi- / gameport, but I doubt it will be possible to run MIOS 2 (even with the use of KernelEX) on Windows ME.

9

The schematic does tell you how to connect the LEDs, though not necessarily what the best way is to place them on your control surface. Here’s how I did the modulation matrix LEDs, which may or may not suit your purposes.

 

 

I attached the LEDs directly onto the front panel (the holes are snug enough to hold them all in place), and then soldered the necessary anodes/cathodes together with pieces of wire. I understood you are going to solder them onto a veroboard first, so you might have to modify my approach a bit.

 

Before you start placing the LEDs on the board, might want to cut one of the legs of each a bit shorter than the other – cathode or anode, doesn’t matter as long as you know which one – unless they already are; that way you will know which one is which. That makes soldering them matrix-style easier as well, as there’s two “levels”, where the first has the anodes together vertically, and another where the cathodes are together horizontally (like in the picture above; I’m not sure how well this 3D property can be seen there).

 

If you’re going to use veroboard which has “dots” on the solder side, you probably want to solder both legs on the solder side; in my experience the “dots” on this kind of veroboard come off quite easily if you heat them too much, or if you apply too much pressure – both can happen easily, at least to me :slight_smile: Personally I wouldn’t use “dots” veroboard for anything.

 

If you’re using “striped” veroboard (where the solder side is much stronger), you could separate the anodes and cathodes by soldering e.g. the cathodes on the solder side, and bending the anode legs to that they stay on the “top” side of the veroboard, and connect the necessary anodes with wires. But this is in case there will be enough room left for the legs to be on the top side, between the veroboard top and control surface front panel.

 

I just hope this is no too difficult to visualise :slight_smile:

 

Bridges means just wires.

 

The normal way to upload applications via the MIDI connectors is to use a USB-MIDI interface and MIOS Studio. There’s a blacklist on the wiki, which lists the interfaces that people have had problems with. The list is by no means complete. I bought the one I’m using on eBay for a few euros, and luckily it worked. Here’s an example of what I mean. I don’t know whether this particular model will work – it might, or it might not. I don’t know how many of the various USB-MIDI interfaces don’t work, maybe it’s just a few and the rest are ok or something.

 

Using a USB-MIDI interface to upload applications on the PIC presupposes that the MIOS bootloader has been flashed on the chip.

10

I used two layers of striped veroboard for the matrix, one for anodes, one for cathodes.

Stripes where going left-right on one and up-down on the other.

I can’t recommend this approach though, as it’s a royal PITA to troubleshoot.

11

Thanks for the replies, I ordered this midi cable http://www.dx.com/p/usb-midi-cable-730#.U1uywFeSPlY and some new (shorter) buttons http://www.dx.com/p/nylon-pp6-dc-12v-50ma-tact-switch-black-100-piece-pack-123651#.U1uyyFeSPlY

 

Now searching for all the stuff I need to etch PCBs, like Iron Chloride :slight_smile: I think etching them might be the easiest way.

12

Why bother with etching?  Check Smash Tv’s website and especially the Low Value Order pages.  Great PCB’s, fast delivery!    http://www.midibox-shop.com/buy_lvo.html

 

Just make sure each parcel is below 30 USD // 22 EUR.. 

13

I finished the led board, seems to be working fine. I’m going to try making the pcbs myself, first. My first attempt with ironing and Sodium Persulfate were a failure, Now ordering photo sensitive boards, borrowing Iron Chloride and a decent etching tank. I think it’s more rewarding when I make them myself.

14

After some time not being able to spend time on my Midibox I did continue with my build.

 

I etched all circuit boards after using a laser printer for transfer toner. I got my PIC programmed and with some help from SmashTV got the SID application installed also.

 

For the front panel; I exported the .fpd file to .svg and split it using Inkscape. Then tried a laser cutter to cut it from 2 pieces of thin plywood, but it completely misaligned everything. So I will probably try that again or print out the front panel design and glue it to the plywood and then cut out and drill all holes.

 

There are still some things to do on the electronics, but I’m making good progress.

 

To do:

  • Convert my 8-bit lcd connection on the MBHP_CORE to 4 bit and solder in a diode and resistor.

  • Connect all boards

  • Put in all IC’s

  • Add capacitors to the DoutX4 boards

  • Connect switches and leds

  • Find a connector for the C64 power supply

 

Anyway, here are some photos of my work so far:

 

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