Yet Another Ableton Live Controller Concept (Midibox64 + Midibox64e)

MIDIbox HUIs
1

55 Encoders + 16 Push Button Encoders = 71 LED rings

9 Linear Pots

80 LED Push Buttons - I would like these to turn on/off when pressed

2 LCD Screens

Please forgive the noob questions,

Is it possible to have this many Encoders/Push Buttons/Pots/LED rings?

What kind of information can be displayed on the LCD screens?

What MidiBox Project(s) should I be modeling this after?

For the Filter toggle I was hoping to get some sort of LED push button that would cycle through 4 colors indicating which filter type was selected. Is this possible?

My first impressions are this will take 2 Midibox64e but I am still trying to get my head around it all.

Thanks in advance,

Jason Kitchen

*This picture has been modified to reflect changes since original post*

  • Current proposed design

  64 Pots (55 Rotary Pots and 9 Linear Pots)

  16 Rotary Encoders w/ push function

  96 Buttons (16 of which coming from Encoders w/ push function)

  103 LED (80 button LED, 7 linear bar graph LED, 16 LED rings)

2

I think you should really re-build your design…

First of all, you can group encoders, so, button 1 -> equalizers, button 2 -> aux send (monitors?), button 3 -> effects etc.

You can create up to 128 virtual pots, and you will not need all the encoders you use now.

What’s the main you are going to do with this controller?

And before I forget, did you read through all the ucaps pages and looked at various MBOX64’s that are build, to gather some ideas?

3

lots of controls , it’s huge

nice job on the artwork, but what about something with better portability?

thx,

JD

4

I think that your encoders won’t be needed, if you just want a 6 channel mixer. Since it’s ableton, why not create something very cool!? I am planning to build 1 case, with some wires to a playstation controller, a nintendo controller, a floorpedal, a effect-box, etc.

That way, your live shows will be way cooler to watch and listen. Not just some big-ass box, everyone has it..

5

Thanks for the replys so far. I have been lurking here at uCApps for sometime. I’m not gonna say I fully understand yet, but I am trying. I do realize this controller is huge and that it exceeds the limits of one midibox64. My question is can I do this with multiple Midibox64? Or should I be trying something else. Maybe even the USB keyboard Idea I saw someone else discuss in another “Live” Midibox thread. Also having looked at other midibox I thought that many LED rings may be a PITA to wire. So here is an updated picture minus the LED rings on the EQ and Send Sections as I want these knobs ALWAYS to perform these functions. I am not a fan of EQ knobs changing to Sends/FX with a push of a button. I have a trigger finger that is capable of this already. With 16 available presets. It got very confusing moving through presets. If I could get the LCD screen to display whether the encoders were in EQ or FX send mode I would consider this alternative.

Also I’ve decided I would like to add seven 15_LED linear bar graphs to monitor levels with. I noticed some people talking about this in other threads discussing the possibility in Cubase and Sonar. What about Live? Any links to pertinent threads,wiki documentation etc… would be appreciated.

As to the question of portability. I haven’t even got into measuring and creating a scale model/drawing. I am not to concerned about this being to cumbersome. I am more concerned with everything being in one place. Also of course I want to know if the hardware will support my design.

To talk a little bit about how I hope to use Live with this controller. This is essentially becomes a 6 channel mixer with the ARM button determining whether Live will use an internal or external source. Internally I will have 4 digital decks and 2 sampler/looper tracks. Externally I can have up to 6 stereo inputs of my choosing. I.e. 2 turntables and 1 CD deck, leaving me 3 available inputs for well… anything I want. I’d imagine the 16 Push button rotary encoder section will be used for various FX parameters and The 32 yellow Aux push buttons will be for FX on/off, for setting loops, as well as selecting tracks if necessary. Im sure I will come up with more uses never. It hurts to have more buttons

updated design - 49 - rotary pots

                        9 - linear pots

                        7 - 15 LED Linear Bar Graph

                        22 - push button encoders with 22 LED rings

                        80 - LED push buttons

                        2 - LCD Screens

                       

Jason

P.S. I still like the idea of using all encoders with LED rings around all of them. What if when I’m not using it to DJ I want to use this controller for multiple virtual instruments/fx etc? Encoders would be nice.

P.S.S. Also assuming that anyones music will be more interesting to listen to because they look like they are playing a video game just doesn’t make any sense to me.  I will concede that you will be quite the spectacle with your video game controllers and pedal board.

6

A similar setup could be achieved with two BCR2000_Rotary and one BCF2000_Fader. This would cost nearly $500. Of course it would still not have as many knobs/buttons but it would be close. I am hoping to find myself somewhere in this price range. I will probably have to set a limit of $1,000 dollars.

7

This would cost nearly $500. I am hoping to find myself somewhere in this price range. I will probably have to set a limit of $1,000 dollars.

Have you already got an electronics lab set up? Even if you do, that’s a pretty optimistic price… If you don’t…Forget it :frowning:

If you’re aiming to get something for cheap, DIY is a baaaad idea.

8

Well I have been busy reading all day. Here is what I have come up with. My idea is to incorporate a Midibox64 & Midibox64e into one case.

MidiBox64 

  • LCD

  • Core

  • LTC

  • 2x AINX4 - 64 Pots

  • 2x DINX4 - 64 Buttons

  • 2x DOUTX4 - 64 LED

MidiBox64e

  • LCD

  • Core

  • LTC

  • 1x DINX4 - 16 Buttons + 16 available for push button encoders

  • 1x DINX4 - 16 Rotary Encoders with push function

  • 1x DOUTX4 - 23 LED (16 button LED, 7 linear bar graph LED) Leaving 9 available LED?

  • 1x DOUTX4 - 16 LED rings

           

Grand Total

64 Pots (55 Rotary Pots and 9 Linear Pots)

16 Rotary Encoders w/ push function

96 Buttons (16 of which coming from Encoders w/ push function)

103 LED (80 button LED, 7 linear bar graph LED, 16 LED rings)

I do not have an electronics lab. I am sure I will have to invest a pretty penny in this area and will gladly do so. I do not consider it part of my $1,000 dollar budget for the controller. I do have the necessary tools available to me for fabrication of the case.

A quick jaunt over to smashTV had the core components at around $300 dollars. So I still need to price out buttons, LED’s, LCD screens, knobs for pots and encoders etc… Surely these things and materials for the case will be under $700 dollars.

As always any thoughts or links to pertinent related threads would be greatly appreciated!

Jason

9

Yeh a pretty penny is for sure. I’m a few thousand dollars in (3200 aussie dollars to be precise) and still have a couple grand more to spend. Most people don’t spend that much, but I won’t cut corners. I think at the end of the day, so long as you’ve covered off safety, then you’ll be fine, but professionals will tell you that using the wrong tool for the job is not safe, which means you need to get all the tools you could possibly need, in order to ensure your safety.

Don’t forget all the little things… They really add up! I reckon the seller was just about as shocked as me, when I placed my order just for ribbon cable and IDC connectors, which came to over $70 :o

Not that everyone is going to get a shock quite like that, but it does demonstrate well that a small oversight in planning can set you back a fair bit of cash.

You need to consider things like… the LCDs - 2 LCD’s could be $5 or it could be $100. Buttons - 100 buttons could be $50 or $800. Knobs - 100 knobs could be similar, 50-800 dollars. Faceplates - Cardboard with felt-tip marker = $2, but professionally made laser cut powder coated and silkscreened could be $500 for a box of that magnitude…

Then stuff you haven’t even mentioned, like mounting screws and nuts and spacers (wow, expensive!!), and consumables like drill bits and solder (to name an obvious one), antiseptic creams for soldering iron burns (to name a really obscure one)… These little things just keep adding up and up and up.

IMO, you’re best off specifiying what you need, and then figuring out the cost, than trying to make your requirements fit a certain price. That kind of thinking just ends up with inferior equipment, because you end up cutting back on desired features, to meet your price point. My way, happens a bt slower (unless you have a massive budget), but at the end, you get “perfection”. I guess it’s really about what you want in the long run…

10

What about a 6 channel input/output for your laptop/computer. You have a 6 channel mixer, what are you going to mix with that? If there are 6 microphones, you will need to put it in your laptop some sort of way, and that’s very very expensive too.

So, before you spend too much money, what are you planning to mix/create/do with your midibox. There are lots of people here that already build one, and perhaps they can help you with your design. Because your current design is waaaay too big, there are more ways to do this (and a lot cheaper).

11

Im pretty sure the RME Fireface800 I already own is up to the job of getting at least 6 internal inputs into the computer. I posted earlier as to how I plan on using this with Live. It’s a Midibox64 = 6 channel mixer + Midibox64e for controlling FX parameters,On/Off, Loop in/out etc… Since I want to be able to permanently map the mixer section I don’t really see how I can make it smaller/cheaper. Any Ideas?

Also I’m sorry I prematurely put a number on my project. I am inclined towards Stryd_one’s way of thinking. I have started looking at the wiki for the necessary items for the electronics lab and will tackle this first.

Thanks,

Jason

12

I don’t want to ruin your plans, but why not buy a Behringer motorfader control-area (150 dollars?), and build yourself a Midibox 64 with 64 pots/buttons. A lot cheaper, and you are building something yourself. But you have some motor faders, and they are very handy.

13

my 2cents:

use an encoder for scene select as well as the two buttons.

As for price, it depends on how good you are at being stingy.

I’ve got all the parts I need for my midibox64e (minus knobs) for around $200USD

which has a 64 backlit button matrix (like monome) 40 pots, 10 encoders, 4 joysticks and 25 extra buttons.

14

where did u buy that button matrix?

15

Yeh please do tell! :slight_smile:

16

am also interested, where can we find it?