Starting over

MIDIbox HUIs
1

Ok ok ok ok ok…So I delorted my last thread because I’ve rethunk my project.  Here’s what I intend to do:

I’m going to merge 3 LC’s and a several 64E’s into one chasis.  The idea is to create a dedicated set of controlls instead of having to flip through banks of sorts and only having control of one paramter at a time.  There will be 24 channels each with 4 bands of EQ (freq/gain/q on each band) as well as a dedicated pan knob, and of course the mute/solo/rec/select buttons for each channel.  Instead of doing full-out meters, I’m just going to put an RMS/Peak LED on each channel just for reference.  I’m going to do something a bit more advanced for my ACTUAL meters.

I will have my transport, jog wheel, 5-way zoom toggle, timecode etc etc.  I’m going to use the two 2x40 LCD’s just to label each channel.  I tend to use my monitor a lot, the LCD’s are just for reference.

Now for the questions, brace yourself, I have a few.

From what I’ve gathered, this is the list of functions supported by the LC.  I put “?” next to functions who’s purpose is a mystery to me.  If anyone could explain them, it would me most appreciated.

  • Automation

  • Touch ?

  • Trim ?

  • Write

  • Read Off

  • Latch ?

  • Util. Enter ?

  • Util. Cancel ?

  • Hold Layer (I understand the purpose, I just don’t get how this function is controlled)

  • Function (I assume these are just misc. buttons that can be used for whatever)

  • F1-F8

  • Global (My impression is that this changes the function of the faders.  I.e. it switches their control from tracks to outputs to buss’s to aux’s etc.  However, there are still a few of these that don’t make sense.)

  • Audio Instrument ?

  • Audio Track ?

  • Inputs

  • Tracks

  • Aux

  • Busses

  • Outputs

  • User ?

  • View ?

  • Drop ?

  • Cycle ?

  • Nudge ?

  • Marker ?

  • Replace ?

  • Click ?

  • Shift

  • Option (does this do anything in Windows?)

  • Ctrl

  • Cmd/Alt

  • Flip ?

  • Bank (What is the difference between Bank L-R and Channel L-R?)

  • Left

  • Right

  • Channel

  • Left

  • Right

  • Assign (My impression is that this changes the assignment of the Encoders atop each Fader in the LC.  However, since my plan is to dedicate these encoders to Pan, I don’t really need these functions.  Right?)

  • EQ

  • Instrument

  • Plug-in

  • Pan/Surround

  • Send

  • Track

I will be working in Cakewalk SONAR 5, which is supported by the MCU.

Like I mentioned, I will be adding a dedicated EQ section on every channel as well as a side section of misc. encoders to be used to control VSTi’s, plug-ins, and robots to destroy Japan with.  These will be part of the 64E inside the chasis.  I will probably end up chaining CORE’s for this until I get enough encoders.  My understanding is that the LC does NOT support chaining cores, but the 64 and 64E do.

I’m going to buy a MIDI interface to merge all the different signals and just send them out via USB to connect the whole mess to my compy.

I understand that I’m probably biting off more than I can chew with this project, but I’m confident enough in my abilities, and I will have help, as well as these forums  ;D.  I just need these questions answered (for now) so I can start blocking out my system and then work on ordering the parts etc. etc.

Thanks a ton.  I really appreciate the help.

Dan

2

What these buttons are doing does heavily depend on the host sequencer, because the MIDIbox LC itself is “stupid” - it sends a Note event when a button is pressed/released, and it sets/clears a LED when a Note event is received from the host. Same for the LCD (display messages are sent by the host) and for the motorfaders/encoders.

So, you will find a detailed description of these functions in the manual of your sequencer. If not, then it propably doesn’t support it, or assigns another (mostly useful) function to the button.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

3

Oh excellent.  So i can just set those buttons to do whatever in Sysx right?

Another thing I meant to ask, and I know I saw someone do it here, but in terms of changing what the faders are controlling (i.e. tracks, busses or aux) can I have just one set of buttons control all 24 channels?

Someone posted that they did it with a diode, but I have no idea what that means.

4

Hi,

Oh excellent.  So i can just set those buttons to do whatever in Sysx right?

If you mean buttons assigned to the LC part of your box:

No,

your sequencer is using those buttons for several functions.

You just can test what is happening when pressing a button (under the LC protocol).

Or the documentation of your sequenzer is telling you what will happen if you press a button…

I’m going to merge 3 LC’s and a several 64E’s into one chasis.  The idea is to create a dedicated set of controlls instead of having to flip through banks of sorts and only having control of one paramter at a time.  There will be 24 channels each with 4 bands of EQ (freq/gain/q on each band) as well as a dedicated pan knob, and of course the mute/solo/rec/select buttons for each channel.  Instead of doing full-out meters, I’m just going to put an RMS/Peak LED on each channel just for reference.  I’m going to do something a bit more advanced for my ACTUAL meters.

I think you will run into a problem:

If I get you right, you plan to use the channel strip functions of the LC and the 4 band EQ is coming from several 64E’s. I think, this will work as long as you don’t push the channel or group button of your master LC. Then the assignement of the controlled channels will change and I don’t have a clue how you will change the assignement of the channelstrip EQ Encoders.

If your song-projects don’t have more than 24 channels this will be no problem …

You get me? You’ll then controlling channel 2 of your sequenzer and channel 1 of your EQ in the same channel strip, if I’m right.

Perhaps MIOS or your sequenzer can control this but you also have the problem that you will be having a lot of CORES to control … (e.g 4x24 EQ Encoders x 3(F/g/G) = 288 Encoders = 5 Cores, 24 Channel strips = 3 Cores… or did I misunderstood the EQ thing?)

Another thing I meant to ask, and I know I saw someone do it here, but in terms of changing what the faders are controlling (i.e. tracks, busses or aux) can I have just one set of buttons control all 24 channels?

Someone posted that they did it with a diode, but I have no idea what that means.

The buttons (Transport buttons, Jogwheel, aux, Track, Group …) are also controlled by the sequenzer.

I once coupled them with diodes in a 2xLC Box because older versions of Cubase didn’t support a Master/slave configuration of two LC.

Newer Versions of Cubase are suppurting the Master/slave configuration (so I cutted the diodes out again…).

That means you just have to assign the buttons to the master LC. The slave buttons will follow the master.

You don’t need common buttons (and DINs) in the slave Boxes.

If your sequencer supports more than one LC you can forget the diode thing.

greets

Doc

5

Oh snap, you’re right.

I guess I need to figure out a way to link the banks on my channels and EQ.  Perhaps someone knows a way to do that?  What I mean is, instead of having to change the bank of the LC channels and THEN change the bank of the EQ so both are operating the same channel, I can set it up so that I can change both banks simultaneously.  Either that, or I’ll just have to change both at the same time and hope I don’t get everything confused.

I guess SONAR 5 would support Master and Slave LC configurations since they’ve supported the MCU since version 3.  So I guess I’m good there.

6

With encoders, you can change the parameter that the encoder is controlling. With a bankstick, you can control up to a lot of parameters. So the best way for you is to use some encoders :slight_smile:

But why would you use SO many pots/encoders/faders. Your box will cost a fortune, and it can be done much cheaper.

7

With encoders, you can change the parameter that the encoder is controlling. With a bankstick, you can control up to a lot of parameters. So the best way for you is to use some encoders :slight_smile:

But why would you use SO many pots/encoders/faders. Your box will cost a fortune, and it can be done much cheaper.

Call it a fetish, I enjoy knobs and lights and flashy things.

I think I’m going to reserve THIS model for my master project which will involve a LOT more.  I’ve been discussing it with my friend and we think we’re going to use this model to build our final model console.  Basically, it’s going to integrate a rack unit on the inside of the chasis where we’ll be able to mount preamps and patchbays that will be accessable from the rear, essentially turning the beast into a full-out digital console.

I finally (finally) read the manual for the Logic control and it makes SO MUCH more sense now, so I think I’m just going to build a 24 channel LC so I have plenty of channels all at once and maybe do some other cool little things if I can think of any.

Maybe I’ll build a 64e on the side to use with things like Reason and the like.  I’ll see how it goes.

Just real quick-a-like, I’ve got two small questions.

How do I install the “Rude Solo” light.  This is a crucial feature and I MUST have it.  No time to explain, just suffice it to say, this console MUST have a Rude Solo light.  However I can’t seem to find anything that says how to install it.

Second, instead of building full-out meters, I just want an RMS/Peak LED.  How would I wire it to do that instead of the full meter?

Third, since I certainly don’t need multiple copies of the common switches (the assign panel etc.), but I DO need to put in additional V-Select switches, how many DIN/DOUT’s do I need on the slave LC’s and how should I solder them?

EDIT:

Curiously, I found a nifty feature in the Tascam US2400 which can emulate the MCU and HUI protocols.  Their meters are integrated into their encoder LED’s.  You activate the meters with a MTR button.  Has anyone worked out a way to do this?

Also, is there a way to integrate a footswitch into the system for punch-in/out type things?

8

On the internet you should be able to find some circuits for a peak LED.

Your footswitch could be attached with a cable to the DIN, no problem right? Just a longer cable  :wink:

9

On the internet you should be able to find some circuits for a peak LED.

Your footswitch could be attached with a cable to the DIN, no problem right? Just a longer cable  :wink:

I’d have to do an extra circuit?

More importantly though:

Third, since I certainly don’t need multiple copies of the common switches (the assign panel etc.), but I DO need to put in additional V-Select switches, how many DIN/DOUT’s do I need on the slave LC’s and how should I solder them?

Re-post I know, but I’m an attention whore.

10

On the internet you should be able to find some circuits for a peak LED.

Your footswitch could be attached with a cable to the DIN, no problem right? Just a longer cable  Wink

I’d have to do an extra circuit?

No, you don’t.

If you just want a peak LED it should be possible with some coding. The easiest way would be to take the normal meter circuit (http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_lc/midibox_lc_ledrings_meters.pdf) and just leave out the leds you don’t use (no coding then … ;D.)

More importantly though:

Third, since I certainly don’t need multiple copies of the common switches (the assign panel etc.), but I DO need to put in additional V-Select switches, how many DIN/DOUT’s do I need on the slave LC’s and how should I solder them?

… just count by yourself. (http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_lc/midibox_lc_buttons.pdf). Take the master DIN layout and strike out the switches you don’t want.

You can change the assignement of buttons, leds, encoders . The assignement in MIOS can be easily changed by editing the file lc_io_tables.inc (for buttons and leds) and mios_tables.inc for the encoder positions.

greets

Doc

11

No, you don’t.

If you just want a peak LED it should be possible with some coding. The easiest way would be to take the normal meter circuit (http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_lc/midibox_lc_ledrings_meters.pdf) and just leave out the leds you don’t use (no coding then … ;D.)

… just count by yourself. (http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_lc/midibox_lc_buttons.pdf). Take the master DIN layout and strike out the switches you don’t want.

You can change the assignement of buttons, leds, encoders . The assignement in MIOS can be easily changed by editing the file lc_io_tables.inc (for buttons and leds) and mios_tables.inc for the encoder positions.

greets

Doc

Oh, perfect.  I thought I saw something that said that.  I was just curious because it seemed kidna batshit insane to buy DIN/DOUT modules that would mostly be blank.