SEQ v4 CS PCB clone

MIDIbox SEQ
41

6 hours ago, lis0r said:

Sorry for disappearing again - work is absolutely mental.

I’ve been given permission to do a single small batch of the boards, which with my board house is 10 boards.

If TK gives his permission, I’d be more than happy to open source the files. If someone else is willing to take over the boards under the same conditions, equally I’d be happy to pass them on, but again, permission from TK would likely be wise.

Great :wink:

I would be happy if you share your Eagle files than i would make my own PCBs too and share the extra with the Midibox community :wink:

 

42

 

On 7/25/2017 at 9:00 AM, lis0r said:

Sorry for disappearing again - work is absolutely mental.

I’ve been given permission to do a single small batch of the boards, which with my board house is 10 boards.

If TK gives his permission, I’d be more than happy to open source the files. If someone else is willing to take over the boards under the same conditions, equally I’d be happy to pass them on, but again, permission from TK would likely be wise.

The MIDIbox license explicitly allows you to distribute modified MB documentation, so long as you license the modifications under the same terms and shoot an email to TK containing the modified documentation (they also explicitly state that sending the email is all that necessary; no need to receive a response).

It never hurts to check with , but there’s also no need to walk on eggshells regarding the sharing of open-source documentation. 

43

On 7/25/2017 at 9:57 PM, xarolium said:

I would be happy if you share your Eagle files than i would make my own PCBs too and share the extra with the Midibox community :wink:

Same here :slight_smile:

44

lis0r: please ask TK. directly via forum message (these should be delivered again as email) to increase his response time on the open-sourcing request.

jaytee: personally, i would think it is very necessary to wait for his response, even if “waiting for the response” is not explicitly stated in the license.

Many greets,
Peter

45

I recommend to have a single run first to ensure that the layout translation was successful. Once proven, the gerbers can be provided as open source (under whatever license)

Best Regards, Thorsten.

46

On 7/27/2017 at 4:09 PM, Hawkeye said:

jaytee: personally, i would think it is very necessary to wait for his response, even if “waiting for the response” is not explicitly stated in the license.

Can you elaborate? I don’t understand why it’s controversial to share—for free—original work based on an explicitly open-source design. This type of sharing is not just allowed under the license, it’s expected.

47

@jaytee what does upset you if I recommend to wait for the publication until the quality of the board has been proven?

Best Regards, Thorsten.

48

jaytee: the “Wilba MBSEQ CS PCB” design, being cloned or not has never been “free”  in any way before, so imho you are wrong on your assumption, that this is “free documentation”, that could have been openly shared until now. If it would have been “free”, it would have been given out by Wilba or SmashTV years ago, and i can tell you, there have been shortages of the board and users willing to go to extremes to get their hands on the gerbers. Due to a shortage of boards, i built my first SEQV4 on veroboard, too, and it was a long process (but a great experience, that i would not want to miss).

The fact, that TK. now open-sources it is a big milestone for the community, that’s why i think, that TK. must have the final saying in it. And his decision is good, it makes total sense to validate the board, before giving away potentially faulty gerbers to everyone - that would result in lots and lots of support work from active board members to help people with their messed up PCBs. (Again: i do not believe, that it is faulty, it is just good practice to test it).

Many greets,
Peter

49

,

Unless I’ve missed something, it sounds like Lisa is extremely busy with work, may not be in the best financial situation to do a test run of boards and build a prototype on her own dime, and is ready to hand over the project to someone else once she gets permission. Meanwhile, Julian sounds ready and willing to do a test run of boards and build a prototype in order to prove the design; the only thing stopping him is that he doesn’t have access to the design files. I don’t understand why we can’t allow the community to collaborate on this project in order to keep things moving.

16 hours ago, Hawkeye said:

the “Wilba MBSEQ CS PCB” design, being cloned or not has never been “free”  in any way before, so imho you are wrong on your assumption, that this is “free documentation”, that could have been openly shared until now. If it would have been “free”, it would have been given out by Wilba or SmashTV years ago,

Again, unless I’ve missed something, this board is Lisa’s original work. It’s built to the same layout as Wilba’s board, but it doesn’t sound as though she actually had access to his original design files. In any case, the MIDIbox license is clear about derivative works.

50

I don’t understand why you are discussing this - of course, Lisa can give the files to Julian.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

51

Maybe I’m wrong but… I think that if Wilba and Smash Tv can not or no longer want to produce and distribute the PCB, it would be wise and kind to leave the design to the community … Simply :slight_smile:
Did someone ask them?

Best regards

52

This has been tried, but without response - otherwise the clone wouldn’t exist.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

53

Hi Thorsten,
Obviously, but… Who? You did yourself?
Your request and concern should have surely more weight.

Best regards

 

54

I tried to contact Wilba multiple times since several years and never got a response.
Lisa tried to contact SmashTV multiple times - also no response.

I assume that Lisas clone will work, it just needs a prove before it will be provided as open source.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

55

Oh that’s a shame…I suppose they want nobody to make money with it… But in the same time, everything is protected from commercial use when published here, I suppose too. Then…

Lisa, Julian I’m always in :slight_smile:

Best

 

56

7 minutes ago, Antichambre said:

But in the same time, everything is protected from commercial use when published here, I suppose too. Then…

Hello

 

Theoretically, but what can do a small community or a lone designer if stolen, law pursuit is not free…

Then you have to technically prove it and have access to the pcb using the stolen (hardware) design.

All around Midibox and other great DIY community not many complex PCB manufacturing files are available, it’s a good practice, and in fact the safer solution to protect things. Still the concept, shemo, build threads and many info OPEN to anyone.

 

I’m always sceptical when discussions complain about what is not available when you’ll find hundreds pages of info and ready to use design concept.

In french we say “the butter, the money of the butter, and the ass of the farmer…” if the translation make sense

 

Now TK is clear here, the PCB designer is free to release the manufacturing files…, he just ask a restricted proto run to ensur, everting is fine, it’s just some respect to potential builder for less issue possible, as respect to all the community which will take time help to troubleshoot…

At my side I take more than two years and thousands bucks designing a tool around midibox system, then more than 6 month crash test before a release (without manufacturing files) so I completely understand Wilba and Tim and all other spending so much time to make things possible.

 

nice to see you again around the forum, summer holiday ?

 

Best

Zam

57

1 hour ago, Zam said:

In french we say “the butter, the money of the butter, and the ass of the farmer…” if the translation make sense

C’est pas franchement demander le cul de la cremiere!
 

1 hour ago, Zam said:

I’m always sceptical when discussions complain about what is not available when you’ll find hundreds pages of info and ready to use design concept

Among all project that there is here, it’s not just one of them but one of the more and maybe the most important one!

A positive or a negative answer. Just an answer that “It’s a good practice” :wink:

By providing Gerber files(after CAM Process) to only one person in charge to distribute it here only.
->Keeping for them source PCB layout file is the best proof for protection.
->It’s letting this project alive…
Nobody is enough stupid to commercialize exactly same pcb design.
So why?..

Then TK came and answered to all my questions.

But, Yes! It doesn’t matter. The important is to let people building this machine.

Best regards
 

58

10 hours ago, TK. said:

I don’t understand why you are discussing this - of course, Lisa can give the files to Julian.

Best Regards, Thorsten.

I don’t understand either. This is exactly what I was telling Lisa earlier in the thread before  told me I was wrong to have suggested it.

59

If we’ve the same understanding, we can stop the discussion now.

Looking forward for the boards! :slight_smile:

To interested builders: please keep in mind that LatigidOn is working on a new front panel with some improvements:

< base_url >/topic/20286-midibox-seq-new-frontpanel-idea/?do=embed&embedComment=177295&embedDo=findComment

 Wilba’s design is interesting for people who already prepared this variant, or don’t want to wait until the new one is ready (can still take some weeks/months).

Best Regards, Thorsten. 

 

60

14 hours ago, TK. said:

If we’ve the same understanding, we can stop the discussion now.

 

Absolutely. Jaytee, if you really want to discuss further, send me a message via the forum mailer so we keep this thread clean. But maybe better not. I really don’t like discussing with people, who have done nothing for the community, but demand everything and quote license texts and stuff that did not even apply, when the boards in question were made.

Regarding future PCBs and gerbers: if they are not open-sourced from the beginning, my old suggestion still stands: make it mandatory for MIDIbox creators to deposit gerbers @TK. (and TK. only), before any PCB is sold. This might solve a lot of problems in the future, while still protecting the hard work people put into their work. Using this method, we would not have the problem with the SEQ CS PCBs and still have the great MBLRE boards available for general use, they are now lost in time.

Best regards,
Peter